Newbie start with Homematic CCU3: Initiation

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Sergo
Beiträge: 79
Registriert: 01.11.2017, 18:28
Wohnort: Estonia

Re: playing with HmIP-WHS2

Beitrag von Sergo » 08.02.2019, 17:30

Promised details on my current setup with WHS2:
Configured as:
Room: Boiler room
Function: set as Climatic conditions
HmIP-WHS2_1.png
.
WHS 2 device config has some positive surprises and still existing, funny DST bug(DTS offset swapped with UTC offset) when adding new device :)
HmIP-WHS2_3.png
.

Two WTH2 thermostats:
Room: each in separate room
Function: one set as set as Climatic conditions, second as Heating. Its an remains from previous tests. 8)
Channels 5 of both WTH2 connected to channel 6 of WHS2 (as heating pump)
HmIP-WHS2_2.png
.
Within last two days I was observing WHS2 behavior, and I'm pretty confident on trying it out on live setup tomorrow.
Wish me good luck :lol:
Zuletzt geändert von Sergo am 11.02.2019, 21:22, insgesamt 1-mal geändert.

Sergo
Beiträge: 79
Registriert: 01.11.2017, 18:28
Wohnort: Estonia

Re: dry contacts on HmIP-WHS2

Beitrag von Sergo » 09.02.2019, 13:28

Last night, before falling asleep, decided to polish WHS2 setup, just simple "nice things" :lol: :
- Updated connection with WTH thermostats from "Switch toggle" to "Switch On/Off"
- Updated function for one of thermostats connected to WHS2 from "Clima" to "heating"
Tested - does not work. WHS2 do trigger 'On", but never going to "Off".
.
Rolled all changes back - still does not work :!:
:shock: :cry:
In couple of hours decided to leave it for morning...
.
On a bright Saturday morning decided to start form scratch: deleted HmIP-WHS2 switch from CCU3 and attempted to connect it again.
No way :!: HmIP-WHS2 continuously returning error on attempts to connect with CCU3. Damn.. :cry:
Ok, final resort: lets restart CCU3... Up and what a hell?, in Inbox HmIP-WHS2 device 8)
.
Quickly configured WHS2 as:
- Clima function
- Connected with WTH2 (in connection settings leaving default "Switch toggle")
All works!!!!

Just to validate assumption: updated connection of HmIP-WHS2 with HmIP-WTH2 devices from "Switch toggle" to "Switch On/Off" and as result: again same problem described above. Had to repeat all steps again to get it working.
Lesson learned: do not touch connection settings for HmIP-WHS2 in current (1.4.0) WHS2 & CCU3 (3:41:11) firmware versions! Leave in Default - "Switch toggle"
Obviously, this workaround should not be used for long...
.
HmIP-WHS2_4_small.png
HmIP-WHS2_4_small.png (284.97 KiB) 378 mal betrachtet
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Connected "Dry pair" of HmIP-WHS2 to my heater thermostat input.
The only additional component involved is an "slow blow" 5A fuse (cylinder on the right).
I'm ready to dance :roll:
Zuletzt geändert von Sergo am 17.02.2019, 22:44, insgesamt 12-mal geändert.

Sergo
Beiträge: 79
Registriert: 01.11.2017, 18:28
Wohnort: Estonia

Re: playing with HmIP-WHS2

Beitrag von Sergo » 09.02.2019, 13:47

Additional details on use of "dry contacts" in HmIP-WHS2:
HmIP-WHS2_4_connect.png
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I/m in official, public trial mode 8) :roll:
.
First click, click.. it works!!! 8) :wink:
P.S. updated with correct channels (2, 6)
Zuletzt geändert von Sergo am 11.02.2019, 21:31, insgesamt 3-mal geändert.

tomi_cc16
Beiträge: 667
Registriert: 30.11.2013, 16:35
Wohnort: Mordor

Re: Newbie start with Homematic CCU3: Initiation

Beitrag von tomi_cc16 » 09.02.2019, 17:17

Best explanation/test of HmIP-WHS2 available today in the whole internet. *Thumbs Up*

Sergo
Beiträge: 79
Registriert: 01.11.2017, 18:28
Wohnort: Estonia

Re: playing with HmIP-WHS2

Beitrag von Sergo » 09.02.2019, 18:39

tomi_cc16 hat geschrieben:
09.02.2019, 17:17
Best explanation/test of HmIP-WHS2 available today in the whole internet. *Thumbs Up*
Thanks, but it’s just results of my “black box” test.
Guys, do you think there is potential value on reporting my findings to eQ3?
IMHO, as expected, device in “public beta” phase. Common workflow work flawlessly, but any step aside result in unpredictable behavior.
Nothing critical, engineers just need time...
Zuletzt geändert von Sergo am 11.02.2019, 11:14, insgesamt 1-mal geändert.

Sergo
Beiträge: 79
Registriert: 01.11.2017, 18:28
Wohnort: Estonia

Re: playing with HmIP-WHS2

Beitrag von Sergo » 10.02.2019, 07:32

Sergo hat geschrieben:
09.02.2019, 13:47
First click, click.. it works!!! 8) :wink:
Update after 24h: HmIP-WHS2 working stable, it’s warm in da house :D
Switching off generation of heat at the point when current temperature > set point by 0.5C.

Sound like my wish to Santa fulfilled by eQ-3 this year. Thanks :!: :roll:

P.S. by the way, solved problem with one of HM-CC-RT-DN radiator thermostats on second floor(there I have HM devices), something noticed after last firmware update: often radiator thermostat got stuck with valve open at 15-22%, while battery is cold. Reinstalled, reinitialized HM-CC-RT-DN many times, cleaned up valve inside the radiator itself - no changes :cry:
What I noticed while inspecting radiator valve: quite significant power required to operate.
Last week, got my hands on couple of new valve’s for my radiators: comparison confirmed difference in power required to operate. Replaced valve on radiator under question and voila :!: seem like no more “bad software” issues :roll:
Radiator continuously & proportionally getting heat, even at 5% open valve...
Zuletzt geändert von Sergo am 11.02.2019, 11:15, insgesamt 4-mal geändert.

Doctor.ventil
Beiträge: 23
Registriert: 12.08.2018, 13:29
Wohnort: Czech Republic

Re: Newbie start with Homematic CCU3: Initiation

Beitrag von Doctor.ventil » 11.02.2019, 10:01

Hi Sergo.

Just want to double check before I order WHS2 my understanding of the function.

Now I have everywhere radiator thermostat heads HMIP eTRV2, the electric boiler is now managed by dummy thermostat in one refference room with stupid bi-metal management - the only thing it does is when reach the set temperature, it disconnects the cable connection from boiler (I guess there is 24 V in the cable), generally this type of thermostat is called "non potential" in our country.

My expectation from WHS2 is to connect it the same ways you did, just using the channel 3 (according to manual) - could you confirm that should do the job? Meaning whenever any of the thermostat heads ask for warm water, WHS2 will initiate the boiler and in the moment no thermostat head asks for warm watter WHS2 will switch off the boiler? I have not CCU3, just dummy base unit, but Iwould expect this to work same way...

Thanks in advance :-)

Sergo
Beiträge: 79
Registriert: 01.11.2017, 18:28
Wohnort: Estonia

Re: playing with HmIP-WHS2

Beitrag von Sergo » 11.02.2019, 11:01

Doctor.ventil hat geschrieben:
11.02.2019, 10:01
...My expectation from WHS2 is to connect it the same ways you did, just using the channel 3 (according to manual) - could you confirm that should do the job? Meaning whenever any of the thermostat heads ask for warm water, WHS2 will initiate the boiler and in the moment no thermostat head asks for warm watter WHS2 will switch off the boiler? I have not CCU3, just dummy base unit, but Iwould expect this to work same way... Thanks in advance :-)
Hi, I did not test myself with direct connection to radiator thermostats heads (inserted WTH2 to consolidate management and provide locally ability to regulate temp. in individual rooms), but I dont see any reasons why this should not work. If that boiler management contacts are not 220V, use dry contacts as described above. If your boiler really use 24V for heating, double check that Amperage will fit in to spec of relay https://www.tme.eu/en/Document/2962d862 ... hf115f.pdf (sorry if its obvious for you)
.
P.S. as mentioned (and highlighted today above), use of "Switch toggle" workaround is a bit risky, since eventually (for example loss of connectivity) it may cause "flip" of logic to inverse.
Thanks for links supplied by tomi_cc16 in background, this confirms to my assumption of "Public Beta release" for WHS2 and they clearly mentioned that On/Off function is not yet ready for use and suggested reliable alternative. I have requested clarification on this question here https://www.elv.de/topic/heizung-zweipu ... t-aus.html
Zuletzt geändert von Sergo am 11.02.2019, 14:09, insgesamt 4-mal geändert.

Sergo
Beiträge: 79
Registriert: 01.11.2017, 18:28
Wohnort: Estonia

Re: playing with HmIP-WHS2

Beitrag von Sergo » 11.02.2019, 11:45

Copy & Paste answer from ELV on link above:
if you have a CCU2/3 ..for example...general procedure:
*..open "Programs and connections" --> direct device connections --> button "new connection"
*..Settings --> device HmIP-WTH-2/Channel "5"
*..Setting device HmIP-WHS2 --> for example ..channel "2" ..the other channels "3...4 " set in the connection rule to inactive. If you need by channel "6"..set "7...8" to inactive.
*..Profil setttings - receiver --> scwitch on --> switch on delay (not active) --> switch-on time: 5 min

The HmIP-WTH-2 generates only a switch on-signal every ca. 3..4 min, if the on-signal is missing, the HmIP-WHS2 is safely switched off after 5 minutes at the latest (is a saftey function).
It is important to know..the HmIP-WTH-2 does not generate an off-signal..only an on-signal.
This approach already proven by few folks in this forum to work. Will need to find time to test it this week 8) ...

Sergo
Beiträge: 79
Registriert: 01.11.2017, 18:28
Wohnort: Estonia

Re: playing with HmIP-WHS2

Beitrag von Sergo » 11.02.2019, 21:22

I had time to apply suggestion from ELV, along with collection from related treads.
To summarize recommended way for linking HmIP-WTH2 and HmIP-WHS2 :
  • Created group: Hm-IP Heating group, all HmIP heating devices (including WHS2) IN
  • all devices in Hm-IP Heating group set function = Heating. Devices set to different rooms
  • Added connection from WTH2 channel 5 to WHS2 channel 6 (yes, I made mistake previously with used channel on WHS2, updated screenshot above, too)
Details of suggested connection settings below. From first tests - All works like a charm.
HmIP-WHS2_2_new.png
HmIP-WHS2_2_new.png (24.14 KiB) 215 mal betrachtet
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Next update on the morning :lol: :mrgreen:
P.S. Doctor.ventil, if tomorrow morning I will wake-up in 21C, will post to ELV additional question about connecting eTRV to WHS2.. I also have one eTRV installed without use of WTH2
Zuletzt geändert von Sergo am 12.02.2019, 10:01, insgesamt 3-mal geändert.

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