Temperature room and radiators thermostat

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FabFix
Beiträge: 3
Registriert: 23.11.2019, 15:24

Temperature room and radiators thermostat

Beitrag von FabFix » 23.11.2019, 15:51

Hello everybody !

First of all sorry for my bad english ...

I want to buy a wall thermostat :
https://www.homematic-ip.com/en/product ... t-336.html
And 2 or more radiator thermostat :
https://www.homematic-ip.com/en/product ... ostat.html

I have several questions for the community :
- the temperature taking in the thermostat is send to the radiator ?
- how it works with a shared heating system in my old building ? Sometimes the water is very hot, sometimes just warm ... the radiator thermostat open more when it's just warm to reach the "target" temperature taken in the thermostat wall ? it works like that ?
- i need to buy CCU ? 2 or 3 ? or just the ip access point or nothing more ?

To resume that i want it's to take the room temperature with the thermostat wall (put it far away from the radiators) and if i want 20 degrees the radiator open the valves until 20 degrees is ok with the thermostat wall.
I have a big room and that's why i don't want the temperature taken by the radiator valve.

Sorry if it's not clear, i'm french and it's difficult to explain technical stuff or ideas in english.
Don't hesitate to ask me if it's not ok.

Thank you very much !

tomi_cc16
Beiträge: 937
Registriert: 30.11.2013, 16:35
Wohnort: Mordor
Hat sich bedankt: 20 Mal
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Re: Temperature room and radiators thermostat

Beitrag von tomi_cc16 » 23.11.2019, 17:51

Hello FAbix,

welcome the English Section of the Homematic Forum.

Where in France do you live?

Regarding your question:
FabFix hat geschrieben:
23.11.2019, 15:51
- the temperature taking in the thermostat is send to the radiator ?
The wall thermostat (WTH-2) will show you the actual measured temperature and humitity in the room. When you will use the adjusting wheel a new "Should" temperature is set and the radiator(eTRV2) will get this information and e.g. open the vlave. When the heat temperature is reached the wall thermostat (WTH-2) is informing the radiator(eTRV2) and they all will close their valve to not further heat or to hold the temperature.

FYI - There are different HmIP versions of thermostat and radiator - the full list can be found here. (Those with B - are the basic version and normally a bit cheaper)
viewtopic.php?f=49&t=47572#p476251

FabFix hat geschrieben:
23.11.2019, 15:51
- how it works with a shared heating system in my old building ? Sometimes the water is very hot, sometimes just warm ... the radiator thermostat open more when it's just warm to reach the "target" temperature taken in the thermostat wall ? it works like that ?
The radiator will learn how to operate best to reach the required temperature but will also adjust if he will realize he can not reach the temperature - e.g. open the valve more.

FabFix hat geschrieben:
23.11.2019, 15:51
- i need to buy CCU ? 2 or 3 ? or just the ip access point or nothing more ?
Please use just 15min of your precious time and read this topic here - it should answer 80% of all your questions. The other 20% please ask ;-)
viewtopic.php?f=49&t=41325

And if you have more time - all of this:
viewtopic.php?f=49&t=46514

FabFix hat geschrieben:
23.11.2019, 15:51
To resume that i want it's to take the room temperature with the thermostat wall (put it far away from the radiators) and if i want 20 degrees the radiator open the valves until 20 degrees is ok with the thermostat wall.
I have a big room and that's why i don't want the temperature taken by the radiator valve.
No Problem - the "goal" temperature is measured by the thermostat not the radiator.

FabFix hat geschrieben:
23.11.2019, 15:51
Sorry if it's not clear, i'm french and it's difficult to explain technical stuff or ideas in english.
Don't hesitate to ask me if it's not ok.
No worries - we are here to help you :-)

There is even some french Forum but not very active:
viewtopic.php?f=49&t=47867

Also a tipp if you want to buy things - sometimes its cheaper to buy from amazon.de and pay the shipping costs than from amazon.fr
Also check the warehouse deals !!:
viewtopic.php?f=49&t=46608

FabFix
Beiträge: 3
Registriert: 23.11.2019, 15:24

Re: Temperature room and radiators thermostat

Beitrag von FabFix » 24.11.2019, 10:11

Thank you very very much for yours very good answers Tomi !
tomi_cc16 hat geschrieben:
23.11.2019, 17:51
Where in France do you live?
In Strasbourg near Germany :)
tomi_cc16 hat geschrieben:
23.11.2019, 17:51
The radiator will learn how to operate best to reach the required temperature but will also adjust if he will realize he can not reach the temperature - e.g. open the valve more.
Sorry but how it works ? If the water is hot at nine but not at eleven and the day after it's hot at eleven and not at nine i don't understand how he can learn that ...
I know that eurotronics valve now have a temperature sensor inside to know how the water is hot, do you know for Homematic valve ? Or in the future maybe ?
tomi_cc16 hat geschrieben:
23.11.2019, 17:51
Please use just 15min of your precious time and read this topic here - it should answer 80% of all your questions. The other 20% please ask ;-)
viewtopic.php?f=49&t=41325
I've read all thanks, just a litle question more, it's write that i can use just the thermostat wall and a radiator valve (without anything else) but in this case can i still program the valve ? An easy thing like just between 10 o'clock and 8'clock 18 degrees, 20 degrees otherwise.
tomi_cc16 hat geschrieben:
23.11.2019, 17:51
Also a tipp if you want to buy things - sometimes its cheaper to buy from amazon.de and pay the shipping costs than from amazon.fr
Also check the warehouse deals !!:
viewtopic.php?f=49&t=46608
Thanks of that i'll check the prices :-)

tomi_cc16
Beiträge: 937
Registriert: 30.11.2013, 16:35
Wohnort: Mordor
Hat sich bedankt: 20 Mal
Danksagung erhalten: 28 Mal

Re: Temperature room and radiators thermostat

Beitrag von tomi_cc16 » 24.11.2019, 11:26

FabFix hat geschrieben:
24.11.2019, 10:11
Sorry but how it works ? If the water is hot at nine but not at eleven and the day after it's hot at eleven and not at nine i don't understand how he can learn that ...
I know that eurotronics valve now have a temperature sensor inside to know how the water is hot, do you know for Homematic valve ? Or in the future maybe ?
What I can say is that the when the temperature is not reached the thermostat (WTH) will tell the radiators (eTRV) to open more. Or the opposite when temperature is reached. If you want more technical details you can also contact eQ3: [email protected] https://www.eq-3.com/service/support.html
FabFix hat geschrieben:
24.11.2019, 10:11
I've read all thanks, just a litle question more, it's write that i can use just the thermostat wall and a radiator valve (without anything else) but in this case can i still program the valve ? An easy thing like just between 10 o'clock and 8'clock 18 degrees, 20 degrees otherwise.
You can create direct connections between devices but not for all - for some you need a gateway (CCU3 or Access Point) to set this up.
Not sure in this case - you need to try or maybe eQ3 support can answer this.
If you really don't want to use them with an App or gateway later - the cheapest and easiest version would be to buy a HmIP Access Point - create the direct connections and heating profiles for all devices - and then you could, if you want, set the Access Point offline.
Everything should still work because of the direct linking you created - the heat profiles should be saved locally on the devices.
Only minus - the devices will try to reach the Access Point periodically without any respond - this can take maybe the battery faster down.

One question from my site, how did you found out about Homematic IP?

FabFix
Beiträge: 3
Registriert: 23.11.2019, 15:24

Re: Temperature room and radiators thermostat

Beitrag von FabFix » 24.11.2019, 15:59

Thanks again Tomi !

I discover Homematic products with the last post on this forum :
https://community.home-assistant.io/t/e ... r/88430/15

It's talking about the Eurotronic valves i've talking to you.

tomi_cc16
Beiträge: 937
Registriert: 30.11.2013, 16:35
Wohnort: Mordor
Hat sich bedankt: 20 Mal
Danksagung erhalten: 28 Mal

Re: Temperature room and radiators thermostat

Beitrag von tomi_cc16 » 24.11.2019, 16:26

FYI - When you use Home Assistant it also works without any gateway (but also you can connect the Gateways to Home Assistant) - only an USB Stick that speaks the protocol is also possible.

https://youtu.be/G85kOZtt_Uk


I think its also a good price for 59€:
https://m.reichelt.de/set-heizen-easy-c ... stct=pos_1

Or 129,95€:
3x HMIP-eTRV-B
3x HMIP-SWDM

https://www.tink.de/homematic-ip-starte ... eFCvFE1jFU

thermostatique
Beiträge: 10
Registriert: 04.12.2019, 08:31

Re: Temperature room and radiators thermostat

Beitrag von thermostatique » 04.12.2019, 09:12

Funny, I was the one speaking about Homematic product on the Home Assistant page about the Eurotronic Valve. :wink:

Anyway, I have given up on Smart Thermostatic Radiator Valves with Zigbee and Z-Wave protocol (it's a shame really).
I haven't found so many Smart TRV which integrates nicely with Home Assistant and which:
- send the measured temperature
- send the valve position
- can be linked to an external temperature sensor
- can be manually controlled (through a valve opening percentage value setpoint)

Homematic is not Zigbee or Z-Wave, but it seems reliable and open enough. Shame that it seems to be rather unknown outside of Germany.

I don't know if it really requires to have a separate CCU aside Home Assistant. My target is to try to have Hass.io and piVCCU running on the same Raspberry Pi.
piVCCU will be in charge of controlling the TRV and Homematic devices.
Home Assistant will be in charge of controlling the other devices (Zigbee and Z-Wave).
This doesn't seem to be an usual setup, but I'd prefer to use Home Assistant.

tomi_cc16
Beiträge: 937
Registriert: 30.11.2013, 16:35
Wohnort: Mordor
Hat sich bedankt: 20 Mal
Danksagung erhalten: 28 Mal

Re: Temperature room and radiators thermostat

Beitrag von tomi_cc16 » 04.12.2019, 15:54

Should work with no Problem with virtual Containers on Raspian Linux - see technikkram - they offering preconfigured the same just with "ioBroker" instead of Home Assistant.

https://smartkram.de/produkt/download-i ... ker-alexa/

Here how to install pivCCU3 on Raspberry Pi4:
https://technikkram.net/2019/07/pivccu3 ... berry-pi-4

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